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Si daca tot nu i se poate intampla nimic, decat sa arate penibil, atunci de ce nu se testeaza direct pe oameni? Exista multe companii de produse cosmetice care nu testeaza pe animale. Celelalte ar trebui sa ia exemplul. Animalele NU au fost &quot;create&quot; pentru a fi folosite de oameni dupa bunul lor plac (asa cum cred creationistii). Daca tot ne consideram &quot;superiori&quot;, ar trebui sa ne comportam ca atare si sa nu mai producem suferinta inutila altor specii.Mihainoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4930035999637151186.post-36829160396612938992009-05-06T14:14:00.000+03:002009-05-06T14:14:00.000+03:00Pe mine ma deranjeaza suferinta implicata de teste si nu neaparat uciderea. Deci prelevarea de organe nu intra in exemplu. Daca prelevarea de organe s-ar face pe viu ar intra...dar nu se face asa. Daca faptul ca un copil nu poate sa-si exprime consimtamantul pentru teste vi se pare un motiv bun sa nu se faca teste pe el atunci si faptul ca un animal nu poate sa-si exprime consimtamantul ar trebui sa fie un motiv la fel de bun. Pentru ca nu are NIMIC acel copil in plus fata de maimuta, nici inteligenta, nici capacitatea de a se autointretine . Daca preferi copilul doar pentru ca e din specia ta, eu cred ca nu ai un picior etic pe care sa stai... <br /> <br /> Hai sa incerc sa dau un exemplu: Daca ar fi o specie mai evoluata decat noi, cu o inteligenta mult mai mare, putere mult mai mare etc, ti s-ar parea etic din partea lor sa ne foloseasca pe noi in teste? <br /><br /> Probabil ca nu, si i-ai condamna pe cei din specia respectiva de speciism...Tu spui ca iti manifesti suprematia asupra animalului dar asta este o afirmatie fara pic de etica... Sunt sigur ca nu esti ignorant in ceea ce priveste evolutia si stii, la fel de bine ca si mine, ca este o intamplare ca noi suntem mai bine dotati intelectual decat celelalte animale. O intamplare care nu justifica maltratarea celor mai putin norocosi. <br /><br /> Pana acum cativa ani albii isi justificau tratamentul negrilor cam in acelasi fel. "imi pasa de ei, nu vreau sa sufere nejustificat dar pana la urma eu sunt superior, interesele mele, ale noastre, ale albilor, sunt inaintea intereselor lor."<br /><br /> Daca vrei sa motivezi cruzimea impotriva unor organisme trebuie sa ai un motiv mai bun decat apartenenta respectivului organism la o specie, la fel cum detinatorii de sclavi trebuie sa motiveze cruzimea fata de negrii pe o alta baza decat culoarea pielii.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4930035999637151186.post-66647483187569938052009-05-05T19:37:00.000+03:002009-05-05T19:37:00.000+03:00Inca o data, la punctele 1 si 2 sunt convins ca nu v-ati dat seama ca un paracetamol, un ruj, un detergent, in epoca asta, nu au cum sa ii faca rau unui animal. Sa fim seriosi. Ce i se poate intampla unui iepure daca il dai cu ruj sau mascara. Cel putin arata penibil. In majoritatea coplesitoare a cazurilor asta se intampla. Cel mult se mai intampla ca formula sa fie complet gresita si asta e, se arde pe buze.<br /><br />In orice caz, la punctul 2 sunteti sub influenta conceptiei de egalitate in drepturi intre oameni si animale. Eu nu sunt de aceeasi conceptie. Ca specie dominanta, imi manifest suprematia asupra animalului. Ca specie ganditoare, desigur ca nu as vrea ca animalele sa sufere fara rost. Defapt, in realitate sunt chiar foarte oripilat cand un animal sufera fara rost (in ringuri de lupte de caini, de exemplu). Dar cand vine vorba de hrana sau de singurata produselor esentiale (medicamente, produse de igiena esentiale) sau chiar neesentiale (un parfum, un gel de par) prefer sa risc viata unui animal. Interzicerea testelor pe animale inseamna practic interzicerea sigurantei produselor cosmetice.<br /><br />Sunt in schimb de acord cu o solutie de mijloc. Produsele testate pe animale sa fie marcate ca atare. La fel si cu produsele netestate. Acelea netestate vor fi ori mai scumpe (pentru ca a trebuit sa se foloseasca mijloace de testare mult mai costisitoare) ori mai nesigure. Cine iubeste intr-atata animalele, sa le cumpere. <br /><br />3. La punctul 3 nu e un contra-raspuns direct la raspunsul meu, ci ocoleste cu mult subiectul. M-ati intrebat daca e ok sa testezi un produs pe o persoana in moarte cerebrala si eu am raspuns ca e ok in aceleasi conditii ca si prelevarea de organe. Iar sugestia initiala a dumneavoasta cu pruncul a fost ca sub 3 luni nu simte durerea, iar eu am zis ca tot nu e etic pentru ca nu isi poate exprima consimtamantul.<br /><br />Va plac efectele secundare ale interzicerii testarii pe animale, ca nevoia se rasfrange asupra copiilor din tari sarace?<br /><br />http://www.i-sis.org.uk/FDAinDrugTrial.php<br /><br />http://www.scidev.net/en/health/clinical-ethics/nigeria-sues-pfizer-over-drug-trial-scandal.html?utm_source=link&amp;utm_medium=rss&amp;utm_campaign=en_health_clinicalethics<br /><br />Si numeroase, numeroase alte exemple. Chiar tineti la viata si/sau sanatatea unui soarece sau iepure la fel de mult ca la viata unui om?Buciumanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03300597970524880445noreply@blogger.com